SpecialED's MR2 - the bodywork thread

[SpecialED]

OK, so I went up to flyboy’s father-in-law’s place last night to check out what he’s done on my MR2. He had told me that he had completed the work on the front end (repairing a dented pass. Side fender, a similarly deformed plastic bumper cover, removed the Toyota emblem and filled the holes as well as the holes for the license plate, and repainting the bumper cover/fender/front lip). He also wanted to show me the color match with the unpainted areas, show me OEM parts he would need, and discuss other things.

This is what I saw when I walked into the garage –

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/hsunchen/MR2/MR2bodyworkrear.jpg

Obviously, he’s done the preliminary disassembly of the rear end to start the work – trunk lid, wing side pieces, rear bumper cover, bumper supports, and taillights removed.

Here's the main damaged area (he's thinking he can massage out most of the wrinkles in the sheetmetal, use minimal bodyfiller, and not have to cut/weld in a new one). BTW, new OEM MR2 rear quarterpanel is about $650 - about 2 to 3X what a normal quarterpanel costs (of course, it's an MR2!)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/hsunchen/MR2/MR2bodyworkreardrvrside.jpg

He spent a lot of time going over the repairs he’d made to the rear unibody with me (there were still deformed sections inside the trunk that the frame shop hadn’t bothered to straighten after they pulled the suspension straight), and showing me how the engine lid side covers had been repaired prepped for paint (both of them were slighted bent up from the impact). He also wanted to show me what fitment issues he was having with the Tom’s style fiberglas rear bumper cover (more on that later). The replacement OEM trunklid had the Toyota emblem holes welded and smoothed, and was primed gray (but not sanded yet) – but that also looked great – I couldn’t see or feel the original two holes for the emblem.

I think he’s doing a great job of doing the work in a conscientious and methodical way, and he seems genuinely concerned about how I felt about his work. Wayne is really nice guy and so far I’m really glad I chose to have him do the work.

Now, I’d already seen that the side moldings were partially painted white, and I could tell they didn’t match perfectly, but I was trying not to focus on that as I followed along with what he wanted to show me.

What the original plan was to only refinish the parts of the car that absolutely needed to be repainted – the front bumper cover, the pass. Side fender that had been dented, the entire rear of the car up to the T-tops and all the way forward to the rear edges of the doors. He had showed me that by buffing the original paint, he could restore most of the brightness of the OEM paint, and he felt it would match pretty well.

Well, he only polished the bottom of the passenger side of headlight cover, and I took a picture of it to show the match. It’s not perfect, and I think it’s still noticeable, but you can see how much better it is than the completely untouched corner of the hood –

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/hsunchen/MR2/MR2bodyworkheadlightcover.jpg

I think the filled in holes on the bumper cover came out excellent. I looked closely at the area, and I really couldn’t see the original holes, esp. where the Toyota emblem was. Eventually, after much scrutiny, I could see a slightly cloudy area on the front face of the bumper cover where filler was used to smooth the license plate holes, but it would it would never be noticed upon a casual inspection from more than 2-3 feet away.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/hsunchen/MR2/MR2bodyworkfront.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/hsunchen/MR2/Mr2bodyworkfront2.jpg

This is how the front fender/bumper area looked before (It's hard to see in this picture how much it was dented in/damaged, but it was definitely noticeable and ugly) -

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/hsunchen/MR2/MR2frontfenderbumperdamage.jpg

Now my quandary is to decide whether to paint the whole car, or to just save the costs and hope that the partially newly-painted and old-paint-polished sections will blend together OK.

The reasons for not painting the whole car are I don’t know how long I’ll keep the car after it’s done – 6 months, a year, 2 years? And I’m not sure any prospective buyer would give me the additional $700-900 that painting the entire car would cost me. Also, there is good chance there will be at least $80-120 more cost in replacing window moldings, clips, rubber seals around the door handles, etc. that would probably have to be replaced once they’ve been taken off the car (14 year old parts have a way of breaking even when you try to remove them carefully).

The reasons for painting the whole car are that I really LOVE the way the front bumper cover looks, and I’d hate to notice that the whole car doesn’t look that way. I also think “why not?” while the car’s down and mostly apart for painting. The entire rear end (up to the doors) and the front bumper cover are already being painted - why not fill in the gaps in between?

Finally, it looks like I’m going to have to stick with the OEM rear bumper cover. Why? Well, that fiberglas Tom’s cover isn’t going to fit well without a LOT of customization. I knew all aftermarket bodykit parts take some messing with to fit, but this is worse than I expected. Also, just holding it up on the car and looking at it (without any sort of bodykit sideskirt to go with it) looked a little goofy – I started to think it would look weird. Lastly, the opening for the license plate hole looks like it was designed for a JDM or European plate – it’s much longer than a US plate and open in the back, which would expose the bumper support and look odd considering the bumper is white (it would be fine on a dark or black car I think).

Anyway, what do you guys think about getting the car totally painted vs. partially painted?

[phoenixr2]

"
The reasons for painting the whole car are that I really LOVE the way the front bumper cover looks, and I’d hate to notice that the whole car doesn’t look that way. I also think “why not?” while the car’s down and mostly apart for painting. The entire rear end (up to the doors) and the front bumper cover are already being painted - why not fill in the gaps in between?"

you said it yourself. its already down, so why not do it right the first time and get it over with? if you keep the car you will be happy with it, if you sell it, youll be able to get a better amount with the whole car one shade of white:) looking good though.

[Jarod]

Awesome! Glad to see tis finally coming together!

[flyboy]

I'm glad to hear it's working out for you, Hsun. I have complete faith in the guy, and I'm glad you are gaining the same faith.

My father-in-law did such a beautiful job on my car, I use it to pimp out his services. My Camry was smacked HARD on the freeway when a 16-year old with a carload of people rear-ended me going pretty fast. He had to weld in pieces of the rear quarterpanel from another car because the stock pieces were so bent up.

White is the HARDEST color to blend, Hsun! He really is doing a great job blending 14-year old paint!

P.S. - If I had to guess, I would agree with you that you would not get your money out of the car if you decided to repaint the whole thing.

[SpecialED]

Originally posted by phoenixr2

you said it yourself. its already down, so why not do it right the first time and get it over with? if you keep the car you will be happy with it, if you sell it, youll be able to get a better amount with the whole car one shade of white :)


Originally posted by flyboy
If I had to guess, I would agree with you that you would not get your money out of the car if you decided to repaint the whole thing.

So that's one for a total repaint, one against? Anybody else have an opinion?

[flyboy]

I suppose it comes down to if you're asthetically-motivated or financially-motivated. If it's financial, it's probably not a good choice to repaint.

[midshipdrifter]

I say if its not blatantly obvious that the colors arent EXACT, then leave it how it is.

[flyboy]

Anyone that buys an MR2 knows full well they are getting a car that is known to fade. I wouldn't make a big deal out of a repaint.

[SuperWhiteGT4]

I don't see the problem with it if you're painting it the OEM color. You could even add a clearcoat.

Plus, when you decide to sell it, what is the difference in value gonna be repainted vs. not?

[phoenixr2]

even if other people dont notice it, will you? I hate having things that bug me, even if other people dont notice them. its all up to you.

[MR2Fast]

I don't know if in person the difference is mroe than what we can see in these pics, but I would say I don't see a need to repaint the entire car, although that is up to you. Like phoenixr2 said, if it's bothering you, it will continue to until it's fixed. I don't think the amount of money you would spend repainting the whole thing is worth what you'll get out of it monetarily when you go to sell it. If it ain't broke don't fix it is the saying I will apply to this situation.

[SpecialED]

Originally posted by phoenixr2
even if other people dont notice it, will you? I hate having things that bug me, even if other people dont notice them. its all up to you.

I think that's a big part of it. Even if it's pretty subtle, it will probably bug me a bit for however long I keep it.

But, the fact that putting more money into the bodywork/paint just means more money I lose when I sell it in always in my mind too.

I think I've decided on a sort-of halfassed compromise. I think I will have Wayne repaint the headlight covers and the hood to match the new paint on the bumper cover, and have the paint on the other front fender blended to match as best as possible just like it already is on the passenger side.

Why?

Well, this way, at least from two angles (front view and rear view) the car will appear to be completely repainted. When looking at the other two views (the sides), hopefully it won't be TOO apparent that the doors/side mirrors weren't painted.

The majority of the cost in repainting the whole car is disassembly of the door handles, side mirrors and window trims to do it right. Also, there's going to be replacement OEM parts costs involved with that too. So I'm avoiding all of that by not painting the doors.

Also, on most cars, the paint fades the worst/quickest on the flat areas pointing up at the sky - the hood, the roof, the trunklid top. As we all know, red MR2s always fade first on the top of the rear wing. So by painting the trunk lid, the engine cover, the strip of body behind the T-tops, the hood and the headlight covers, I'll have painted 95% of all the surface area on top of the car - the only part left will be that little "U"-shaped strip that surrounds the windshield. Hopefully the paint on the doors will have endured the sun better than the hood/headlight covers because of their location and match the painted trim strips pretty well after their surfaces are polished.

Adding the cost of refinishing the hood, headlight covers, and driver's side fender will only be about $250-350, and I can handle that lost cost I think.

So, if anyone thinks this is totally stupid, here's your chance to tell me so. But I have to say I'm fairly committed to this gaime plan. Wayne thought it sounded like a good solution too (or maybe he was just relieved to hear I was leaning away from a total repaint).

[Michaelmr2]

Show or Go?

Or both?


If you just want the speed, dont worry about the looks as much. Not that your car will look bad, but if you plan on showing it, or at least be known for having a flawless looking car, a good paint job is a must.

[phoenixr2]

hsun, I think your idea is a very smart, and very good compromise. makes sense in multiple ways, I would definately go with that.

[SpecialED]

Originally posted by Michaelmr2
Show or Go?

Or both?



How 'bout "neither"? :( :rolleyes:

At one point, I wanted "go" more than "show" for sure. But now I've more or less given up on it being fast (in my opinion, "fast" is low 13's or high 12's) - hell, I've given up on even the concept of all the fluids staying inside the engine.

At this point, I just want an MR2 to enjoy for an unknown period of time (it will certainly never be a show car) until at one point I decide I want a Corvette Z06 more.

Kinda ironic actually - for years, I used the Z06 as a benchmark for what I wanted my MR2 to equal or beat (it was justification to keep pouring money into it too, if I could build a Z06-beater for less than 1/2 the cost).

But now that used Z06's can be purchased for about what I have invested in the MR2, well . . . I guess I'm thinking about going to the dark side.

[oldster]

OMG......:eek: :eek:

[Michaelmr2]

Originally posted by SpecialED
How 'bout "neither"? :( :rolleyes:


Kinda ironic actually - for years, I used the Z06 as a benchmark for what I wanted my MR2 to equal or beat (it was justification to keep pouring money into it too, if I could build a Z06-beater for less than 1/2 the cost).

But now that used Z06's can be purchased for about what I have invested in the MR2, well . . . I guess I'm thinking about going to the dark side.

A z06 is a solid low 13 second car. You could get into the low 13s without too much money. upgrade your turbo, and your pretty much there.
Hell I have a turbo Im waiting to put in my car and it will be a low 13 second car once that is done. That with an intake and good exhaust...it can be done.

plus half the insurance cost!

Besides, you dont want to be one of "Those guys" do you? Corvette drivers (not all, but most ive seen) are smug jerks making up for something by getting one.

Be proud, your a tuner.

[phoenixr2]

Originally posted by Michaelmr2
A z06 is a solid low 13 second car. You could get into the low 13s without too much money. upgrade your turbo, and your pretty much there.
Hell I have a turbo Im waiting to put in my car and it will be a low 13 second car once that is done. That with an intake and good exhaust...it can be done.

plus half the insurance cost!

Besides, you dont want to be one of "Those guys" do you? Corvette drivers (not all, but most ive seen) are smug jerks making up for something by getting one.

Be proud, your a tuner.
remember you are up here in great 5,000+ feet of air, and your car will not be as quick as you think it is. damn you elevation!

[Michaelmr2]

Originally posted by phoenixr2
remember you are up here in great 5,000+ feet of air, and your car will not be as quick as you think it is. damn you elevation!

But that effects the big v8 Z06 the same way, worse even. Since we are turbocharged, it counters a lot of the altitude difference. I know there is a difference but not as bad as what a z06 will lose at 5kft.

[phoenixr2]

yeah I know the NAs are hit twice as hard. I was just reffering to you wanting to hit low 13s on a upgraded ct26, its hard to do up here:)

[Michaelmr2]

Originally posted by phoenixr2
yeah I know the NAs are hit twice as hard. I was just reffering to you wanting to hit low 13s on a upgraded ct26, its hard to do up here:)

I noticed about a 20% loss from sealevel.

I was expecting 12.8's with my upgrades, and here about 13.2-13.5 somewhere in there.

Certainly a v8 beater or at least a competer

[blackice]

ZO6, are not that fast, i owned 2 of them on the freeway in my probe gt. true, that was after i stuck in about 5k into it, however i don’t see how a MR2 running a little higher boost would louse to one...


Also true my MR2 is running slower then my probe gt, however my 2 is only running 6psi.



BTW looks good sun, its nice knowing your getting you car running again. BTW what is it costing? My daily driver is going to need some work done also, that’s why I ask.

[phoenixr2]

yeah, back on topic, lol. hsun, or damon if you want to ask him if he wants to take up more jobs im sure lots of us need work done. I know I do.

[flyboy]

I actually brought the idea up with him a few days ago, and he said he would accept other jobs.

[Michaelmr2]

Will he install and paint body kits?

[flyboy]

You would have to approach him individually for that, I didn't ask him about that.

If you want, I can put you two in touch. Drop me an email. damonb@avaya.com.

He probably would do it, but I would like you to hear that from him.

[SpecialED]

Originally posted by Michaelmr2
A z06 is a solid low 13 second car. You could get into the low 13s without too much money. upgrade your turbo, and your pretty much there.
Hell I have a turbo Im waiting to put in my car and it will be a low 13 second car once that is done. That with an intake and good exhaust...it can be done.

That is what I thought. I already have a built motor, TD06, HKS 264 cams, blah blah blah. Best I've run is only 13.77 at 107 mph. I know it can be faster with better tuning and driving, and I know some people have gone low 13's with less parts/$, and that pisses me off too. I'm just tired of fucking with the car.


Originally posted by Michaelmr2
plus half the insurance cost!

Eghh. I don't care. I'm 35 and have a pretty decent driving record; I can afford the insurance.



Originally posted by Michaelmr2
Besides, you dont want to be one of "Those guys" do you? Corvette drivers (not all, but most ive seen) are smug jerks making up for something by getting one.

Be proud, your a tuner.

Uh oh, sounds like somebody's making assumptions about people based on what they drive! ;) It's OK; I do it all the time.

But you guys are not thinking of the big picture. The C5 Vette is one of the best chassis for handling and autocross available. It's way stiffer and easier to drive at the limit than an MR2. The C5 was designed in the mid-90's; the SW20 MR2 was designed in the late 80's. It also has better brakes (stock), a bigger footprint, as well as electronic stability management that you can utilize as you're learning to help protect your investment. It's also a more practical car in terms of space for weekend roadtrips and gas mileage than a highly-modified MR2T.

Don't get me wrong; I still love the styling of the MR2. And I will always love the underdog. But I would also like to have a car that is fast out of the box, and I don't have to mess with too much.

Last but not least . . .


Originally posted by blackice ZO6, are not that fast, i owned 2 of them on the freeway in my probe gt. true, that was after i stuck in about 5k into it, however i don’t see how a MR2 running a little higher boost would louse to one...

I'd like some of what blackice is smoking, it must be some pretty good stuff!!!

[MR2Fast]

I as well need to contact him and to see about getting my whole car repainted.

[flyboy]

He's not crazy about whole car repaints, but the MR2 is relatively small with T-tops, so he might go for it.

Drop me an email. damonb@avaya.com. I'll put you in contact with him.

[phoenixr2]

is it done yet?;)

[SpecialED]

I called last week and apparently it's coming along nicely. The rear quarter is saved and straightened, and he's test-fitted the trunklid and it's all working out apparently.

I'll probably make another visit and check it out soon. I don't expect it to be done completely before the end of February, but I'm hoping . . .

[jonathonbarton]

I'd be curious to see what he thinks he can do with this...it's the one serious flaw on our $600 dedicated-racer... :)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v297/jonathonbarton/MR2/Picture058.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v297/jonathonbarton/MR2/Picture059.jpg

[flyboy]

jonathonbarton -
The first step is to get an estimate. He won't give one over the phone, he wants to see the exact condition, which means you need to physically meet him. There are a couple of options there.

Email me if you want to pursue it. I will put you two in contact. damonb@avaya.com.

[SpecialED]

Originally posted by SpecialED
I called last week and apparently it's coming along nicely. The rear quarter is saved and straightened, and he's test-fitted the trunklid and it's all working out apparently.

I'll probably make another visit and check it out soon. I don't expect it to be done completely before the end of February, but I'm hoping . . .

Well, it's before the end of Feb, and the bodywork is done!!!!

Teaser pics . . .

BEFORE

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v634/SW20MR2/MR2damagedrearend.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v634/SW20MR2/new%20MR2%20bodywork%20pics/P1010760.jpg

AFTER

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v634/SW20MR2/new%20MR2%20bodywork%20pics/P1011402.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v634/SW20MR2/new%20MR2%20bodywork%20pics/P1011404.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v634/SW20MR2/new%20MR2%20bodywork%20pics/P1011405.jpg

[midshipdrifter]

O man, it looks awesome. And you're seroiusly thinking about getting rid of it?

[phoenixr2]

damnnnn man! more beautiful then before. thats awesome. so now you have no excuse for missing meets ;)

[SpecialED]

Thanks guys. Now I just have to find a replacement alternator (is the JDM alternator the same as the USDM? Someone on the big board is selling one for $60 shipped I think) and then get it replaced.

Welcome home MR2. Yes, I'll get to working on you again ASAP. Evil, needy temptress. :rolleyes:

[oldster]

Originally posted by SpecialED
Thanks guys. Now I just have to find a replacement alternator (is the JDM alternator the same as the USDM? Someone on the big board is selling one for $60 shipped I think) and then get it replaced.

Welcome home MR2. Yes, I'll get to working on you again ASAP. Evil, needy temptress. :rolleyes:

$60 dollars shipped, 120 day warranty, ask for Alice.

http://www.andrewsautoparts.com/

[phoenixr2]

usdm/jdm wont matter. you have to make sure you get a 91-92 PS one though. there were two different sizes.

[SpecialED]

Thanks for the info guys. I will build an aluminum cover for it of some sort too in order to keep future oil leaks from dripping directly into it hopefully.

[[jsr]Brendon]

Looks very very nice Hsun. Congrats!

[Phoenix]

looks awsome!! great bodywork

[flyboy]

Man, my father-in-law does great work! White is a REALLY hard color to work with, especially 14-year-old white without a clearcoat that's faded over the years. He did a beautiful job.

[MR2Fast]

He did a great job. Does he repaint cars and such as well, along with a little body work. Where is he located?

[SpecialED]

Originally posted by flyboy
Man, my father-in-law does great work! White is a REALLY hard color to work with, especially 14-year-old white without a clearcoat that's faded over the years. He did a beautiful job.

He did perform excellent work, but to tell the truth, it doesn't match perfectly. I'm not unhappy with it, but it certainly is not an exact match.

These pictures I took at night with a flash for some reason highlight the significant differences in the paint color/tone . . .

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v634/SW20MR2/new%20MR2%20bodywork%20pics/P1011406.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v634/SW20MR2/new%20MR2%20bodywork%20pics/P1011407.jpg

But, I don't think a casual observer would notice at all, daylight or at night . . .

[oldster]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by SpecialED
[B]He did perform excellent work, but to tell the truth, it doesn't match perfectly. I'm not unhappy with it, but it certainly is not an exact match.

Were you expecting a perfect match?

[flyboy]

My father-in-law works in Denver and lives near Conifer. He's 45 minutes from my house in North Denver.

[MR2Fast]

I am definitely going to see what he can do once I have the money to get it done. I am looking at getting my car painted SMG or something close and getting a dent/scratch taken out.

[SpecialED]

Originally posted by oldster
[QUOTE]
Were you expecting a perfect match?

No, I was merely contesting the fact that the new paint was a perfect match to the old finish. I also thought it was odd/interesting that the mismatch was much clearer with the highly directional light of the flash, and that others might appreciate documentation of that effect.

[oldster]

Understood, judging from your previous posts you were expecting that, no? We've been playing with mine also and it is very dependent on the light direction or source for how much you can notice a difference.

[SpecialED]

Originally posted by oldster
$60 dollars shipped, 120 day warranty, ask for Alice.

http://www.andrewsautoparts.com/

No offense oldster, but I ended up going with some place in Missouri (that's pronounced "myzzur-ah" y'all :D ) -

www.jcautoparts.com

- only $45 shipped; 90 day warranty. Dude on the phone confirmed that it was from a P/S MR2, 100 amp unit.

In case anyone else needs a '91-92 P/S alternator, this place has one for $45 plus $10 shipping to Colorado -

http://recycler.car-part.com/Exit30/

Also, did you know the '93-up MR2 P/S alternator is rated for 90 amps, while the '91-92 are 10 amps more?

Hopefully I'll have the alternator and the bent-up exhaust situation fixed by next weekend - I can't wait!

[oldster]

No offence taken, glad you got a good deal. Are you going to let the guy in Montreal know you're not serious now?

[SpecialED]

Originally posted by oldster
No offence taken, glad you got a good deal. Are you going to let the guy in Montreal know you're not serious now?

* muttering to self under breath - "jeebus H, this guy's everywhere - I don't need another mother . . ." *

Hey, that's a good idea! I'll do that.

[oldster]

Originally posted by SpecialED
* muttering to self under breath - "jeebus H, this guy's everywhere - I don't need another mother . . ." *

Hey, that's a good idea! I'll do that.

I knew you were too fine a lad just to leave him hanging.......:)